Big changes at Cars & Coffee

[Steve Simmons]

Originally posted on Vintage Motoring's news page

The organizers of Cars & Coffee in Irvine have issued a statement addressing the problem of modern car groups hoarding the limited amount of display area in the PAG lot. Apparently this has been an issue for a while, but the final blow was when "NSX day" showed 100 cars, and then 75 Honda S2000's crashed the gate, taking up most of what was left of the parking lot. They were asked to park elsewhere but reportedly ignored the gate workers, yelled insults and drove in anyway. After the show, the organizers sent out the following message:

I just returned from Cars&Coffee. Way too many "normal" cars in the display area. We had to close the "Display" lot at 7:15am because of overcrowding. Today was not the vision of C&C. We have decided to "re-calibrate" Cars&Coffee, starting next Saturday Feb 7th and future Saturdays, only "pre" 1978 and "Special Classic Automobiles" will be allowed into the "Display" lot. All others will be directed towards the "Spectator" lot and parking structure. There is a new "Every Saturday" car show starting in Orange County that may appeal to many enthusiasts starting March 7th at the "Orange County Market Place". Please pass the word.

Freeman

A large number of interesting cars that should have been in the show were forced to park elsewhere or leave, as the lot was completely full before the official opening of the gathering. Arguments are still raging about the details of what happened, but the problem is obvious and the organizers of Cars & Coffee have been forced to take rather drastic action to prevent it from happening again.

The "tuner" crowd are understandably upset about the new rules, and undoubtedly owners of super cars will be equally so. However most car enthusiasts would surely agree that the average person would rather see something unique or different at a car show than to walk past rows and rows of the same cars they can see at the dealership near their homes. Gatherings like these are the most fun when a person can see a mix of classics, hot rods and newer cars that are unusual, modified in an interesting way or somehow different than the cars that should be parking in the spectator lot.

It seems a fair assumption that the new rules are a result of the inability for anyone to come up with a way to let some newer cars in and turn others away, without appearing discriminatory. Hopefully the organizers will find a way to balance the rules but for now it appears they have eliminated their greatest problem with the gathering and gained valuable time to evaluate their options.

[Steve Simmons]

Being a classic car guy, I can't say I'm entirely unhappy about the new rules. When I go to a car gathering, I don't want to feel like I'm visiting Vista Ford / Madza. That doesn't mean I don't appreciate modern cars that are unique or unusual, I would just rather see things that I can't see anywhere else, whether it's a 1935 Delahaye or a 2008 Alfa Romeo 8C.

It's too bad some people had to be jerks and force these kind of rules but personally I'm more likely to attend now than I was before. Now if we could just get the 50+ Mustangs to stop taking the prime spots at Supercar Sunday!

[spitfire]

Very interesting development, and it looks like they are attempting to get another show going to allow those modern cars in. Although it is kind of sad some of the modern supers won't be allowed in. Even though I have never been to one, just the logistics of getting up at 7am to go walk around a lot 45 minutes away. If I drive that far I would rather be at Disneyland.

[caliwagon]

Having been to the event several times, I can understand the decision. Truth is, I think I'm more likely to make another trip down there now that this has happened. Though, if it had been up to me, I would have drawn the line in the mid-eighties. I like quirky 80's cars a lot.

[designsa]

Saw this topic and had to mention a past experience. Back in the Crystal Cove days, I was directed to the "general" / "find an open space in the boonies" - parking as the central area was nealy, but not quite full. Apparently they were still expecting a few more orange and green Gallardos... I was driving my LP400. More power to Freeman and John - these events need to celebrate the enthusiast and the interesting.

Steve

[Steve Simmons]

Hi Steve, welcome to the forum!

I agree with your comments. C&C, and other such gatherings, should really cater to the less common machines and to true car enthusiasts. The Mazda club can have a gathering anywhere at any time, but the really interesting stuff doesn't get out every day and should have a place to be appreciated by those who don't normally get to see them.

I may not have made the same decision about C&C if I was running the show, but I would certainly have done something similar to prevent the problem from reoccurring. I can appreciate how well designed an S2000 is, but I see numerous examples every day. I don't need to see 75 of them while the less common (and arguably more interesting) cars are being turned away.

Now how about a few photos of your cars in the "Post a picture of your ride" thread? You have quite a stable there!

[caliwagon]

Looks like they've actually "reversed" the pre-78 decision, but are still urging (much stronger than before) that only very unique cars be present in the show lot.

[Steve Simmons]

Really! Must have been recently. I just got an email from an M.G. club about British Car Day coming up, and it included the pre-1978 rule. Should be interesting to see what happens.

[caliwagon]

http://forum.carsandcoffee.info/showthread.php?t=7341

[Steve Simmons]

Wow, the announcement was very well stated and to the point. I hope people actually respect the event as requested.

From John's link...

Attention all Irvine Cars and Coffee patrons and participants. Freeman Thomas one of the organizers, has made the following announcement

-------

As many have pointed out, we're faced with overcrowding at Cars & Coffee. It has been our desire from the outset to welcome EVERYONE, but that has been with the request that this be a word-of-mouth gathering, not promoted online or through the media. This is why we have asked area media and websites to not cover it from the very start, and most have been cooperative about that. The original vision of Cars & Coffee continues to be the preservation of what was started at Crystal Cove, to host cars that are of interest and are unusual. It has never been a "commercial" thing. We enjoy the simplicity, just like we enjoy the racecars of the 50's w/o advertising. We frown on commercial activity at C&C. Even selling your car must be done discreetly (no big signs). If people are interested in your car, trust us, they will see a small business card or advert on your seat. Even us, we only show something if it is of interest at C&C.

What makes it "of interest?" How to define "unusual?" You'd get lots of opinions on that. One suggestion we've heard is... cars that aren't driven to work every day. If it's a car that is driven every day, odds are, it's not a car that will get people out of bed at 6 a.m. on a Saturday. Of course there will be a few exceptions (we won't penalize you if you drive your Talbot-Lotus to work), but that can be a general guide. If you remember the original Crystal Cove gathering, they did get to the point of excluding cars. We are trying to avoid that and we have only turned away cars when we are full. We rely on people to "self-police" in their awareness as enthusiasts that a car you'd see in the shopping center parking lot on a Tuesday is probably not a top priority for the exhibitor lot at C&C. Such a car shouldn't be taking a space on Saturday morning that would require us to turn away a Goggomobil, a Jaguar XK-120, a Bugatti Veyron or a Ferrari 599. It shouldn't prevent us from allowing a manufacturer to reveal their latest hotly-anticipated model like the Honda Clarity, Fiat 500, or Nissan GT-R, or perhaps a manufacturer's concept car(s) or a ????? because the lot is full. Those cars DESERVE to have an exhibit spot. We're all about interesting AND unusual cars. We're discussing a lot of solutions including using the spectator lots more creatively.

Our parking structure holds 700 cars! We urge everyone to use it if you bring something not appropriate for the show. It's a matter of courtesy for your fellow enthusiasts. The south lot holds an additional 70 cars behind the building and 80 cars at the top of the hill behind the structure. These might be used to extend the show especially as the weather gets nicer. Ideas like reserving the spots in front of the cafe for car clubs or same model car groups are a possibility, but please ask first.

We ask everyone to please help us preserve what the founders of Crystal Cove began. Respect the integrity of the exhibit area and use the parking structure for spectator cars. We are VERY open to POSITIVE and POLITE suggestions!!!! Above all, communicate with us, the organizers, especially if you are thinking of showing up with your whole forum in tow. Please get permission first or at least respect the decision of the organizers when they ask you to park together in the spectator lot.

We have hosted C&C since it began in October 2006. That's 120 shows and over 60,000 cars. C&C has had its low points but its high points have exceeded even the original Crystal Cove such as when Ferrari, Alfa Romeo, Porsche, "Powered By Ford", "British Cars" and BMW were the "Featured Marque" due to great organizing by the clubs. I think this is why we love C&C.

BTW, some people have suggested using the large lot across Gateway. That lot belongs to the Irvine Company and we'd have to rent it (not cheap ... we checked), so that's not an option.

The "bloom" seems to have come off the rose, so it's time to prune it. If you want C&C to continue we all need to remind each other that we're all guests on PRIVATE PROPERTY at C&C. The Mazda and Ford employees go out of their way to share the space with all of us. In turn, we ask that everyone RESPECT THE PROPERTY, RESPECT EVERYONE AT THE SHOW (including the lady out front who greets you at 6 a.m. with a smile. She has probably experienced/driven more classics, exotics and performance cars than most of you. She's the one Dan Gurney, Stirling Moss and Carroll Shelby know as "Linda."), USE TRASH RECEPTACLES, and DRIVE CONSERVATIVELY. Only by doing these things can we keep our welcome.

John and Freeman